VC-1 workflow & ProRes in Vegas

[Chris Solo]

Two issues.  I hope this is where I should put this.  

First, I had been using DVDFab to rip Bluray's to m2ts for fan editing in Vegas.  I just realized that if the bluray uses AVC then I'm golden but if it uses VC-1, I'm hosed.  Both Vegas and Hitfilm just crash.  Just curious what workflow some of you recommend.  

Second, I have a couple of .mov files to work with in Vegas Pro 13.  Both are ProRes.  Media Info indicates that one is 422 HQ and the other is 422 Proxy.  The 422 HQ imports fine.  But the 422 Proxy imports as audio only.  Incidentally, the "problematic" 433 Proxy file plays with audio and video in VLC, Media Player Classic, Quicktime (of course) and I can import it onto a timeline in Hitfilm.  However Windows Media Player only plays the audio as well, no video.  I am about to start a big project and I want to make sure I request the proper delivery format.  I have been pulling my hair out since 11:30 last night googling for a solution - non stop.  I'm loopy.  Hoping someone can shed some light.

[Colek]

If you have enough disc space, convert the VC-1 video to some loseless codec such as Lagarith, this will work fine in Vegas.

[Chris Solo]

Thanks for the fast reply. I was reading about lagarith and magivyuv but this is where I am embarrassed to say, especially on a forum like this, all I've ever done is work with files that open natively in Vegas and Hitfilm. Can you point me to a guide for working with those codecs? I am assuming we are talking ffmpeg or something similar? I don't mind reading and figuring it out as I go and prefer that since that's the only way I'll learn. And one other thing about the ProRes - Neither of the prores files I have will playback video in windows media player, just audio. Curious. Gotta be something I'm missing... I just hate to start digging too much with no idea where to dig because I'll end up screwing up worse

Jedit: Ah.... VirtualDub? or am I on the wrong track here? It's been ages since I messed with that.

[Colek]

Actually I have never worked with ProRes codecs so I won't be able to help you with that.

As of Lagarith/MagicYUV, I just load the video into VirtualDub using AviSynth script and save to .avi with one of the said codecs used as compression.

[Chris Solo]

Gotcha. Thanks for the clarification. Time to do some learnin'

[PDB]

Colek is 100% right, you should convert VC-1 to AVI (Lag or Magic). Follow his advice on that one. There is a discussion on this forum about converting VC-1:

https://fanrestore.com/thread-502.html

Also you can use eac3to

As for prores. Not sure since I don't have vegas but for Premiere if you have quicktime loaded you are gold to read prores on windows (can't write them unless on a mac)

[Chris Solo]

Yes I have Premiere and things work better in it I like Vegas because it started out as a DAW of sorts and became the editor it is, warts and all, today. I am just used to the layout since my background was audio. BUT I think I have some other things going on. Vegas won't load a 2 hour avc clip in m2ts but will load a clip that's ten minutes no problem. HDCinematics Convert 3 will not convert anything to dnxhd or prores so... some good old fashioned troubleshooting is about to go down. I think a fresh unintall/reinstall of things is order and some general housekeeping before I get myself too worked up. Reading the other thread now. thanks (I made the mistake of kneejerking and uninstalling quicktime based on the security concerns and although I have since resinstalled, it seems things are not like they used to be)

Jedit: HDCinematics Convert V3 is working with prores. My mistake. And the customer support is top tier.

[jerryshadoe]

Personally, I am using Vegas Pro 11 (it was the last 32bit version) and even with all it's faults, it's still a decent app and I've gotten comfortable using it. However, because I've been using Vegas for so long (since version 6) I am also aware of all the f*** ups of the app too. In my experience, Vegas handles most lossless codecs decently, but lossy codecs (ESPECIALLY avc) do not act right when you are doing major editing. (the only exception for lossy codecs not posing issues in vegas, were SD xvid avi's) The more changes you make to your footage (especially when trying to fanedit a two hour film) the more everything goes out of whack. This is why I started using lossless intermediary files in all my projects, usually using LAGS. Vegas can read it easily and encodes quickly using it too, so - win, win. I also noticed that Vegas is very weird about video/audio codec/container "standards" which is why I always demux the video/audio streams I'll be working with and then load the video and audio separately onto the timeline and there are easy ways of "binding" those to each other so everything stays in sync.

Vegas has NEVER cooperated with VC1 and I've always had to convert that footage to LAGS first, so I agree with everyone else on that one

[Chris Solo]

It's been about a year and a half but I did a fan "transform" of That's Entertainment. My home theater uses a 2.35:1 AR screen and that movie was transferred to blu-ray with varying aspect ratios, obviously, but designed for viewing on a 16:9 screen. I transformed the clips to all work in the 2.35:1 aspect ratio of my screen so I can watch it in my theater. I hope it didn't sound too convoluted. Anyway I did that in Vegas Pro 13 and I used DVDFab to rip the blu-ray. I have a server now and the HDD that had that finished project was repurposed for my server and I forgot to copy the movie. I said all that to say, I was simply trying to recreate that project and for the life of me I can't get my rip to open in Vegas. That's what got me on this troubleshooting tear. But I'm getting a grasp on things again - finally. I am appreciating intermediates too. I tend to learn by doing, then failing, then failing again then getting it right eventually. It's always nice to have a place to ask something without being made to feel like an idiot for not knowing.

Jedit: Just so no one tries to chastise me - I didn't change the aspect ratios, I just reformatted everything so that everything except scope ar is windowboxed when viewed on a 16:9 TV but pillarboxed in my scope theater setup. I'm sure everyone got that but just in case. Didn't want someone thinking I cropped the top and bottom of Singing in the Rain or something like that lol

[jerryshadoe]

...But I'm getting a grasp on things again - finally. I am appreciating intermediates too. I tend to learn by doing, then failing, then failing again then getting it right eventually. It's always nice to have a place to ask something without being made to feel like an idiot for not knowing...

Yeah, intermediary files take up a lot of HDD space, but they make a project flow so much better and help eliminate errors associated with trying to process compressed video (especially inside of Vegas, lol)

When it comes to your learning process, "Welcome to the club!" LOL uperman:
The majority of us have been going thorough a similar process and still are to this day; constantly learning more and more... Having a forum like this one, with like-minded individuals, helps a lot and you will find that the "core" members of the forum are rather friendly and can be very helpful. Never feel like there's a question that is "dumb," as we all have to learn at one point or another and none of us were born knowing how to do any of this stuff