[Released] Terminator 2 CDS mix

[dvdmike]

The first Seven DVD used the same mix as the laserdiscs which was the near-field mix made for the Criterion by Ren Klyce.

Sering as we're going wildly off track I'll tell everyone what I had for breakfast, a full English. Okay once in a while but I won't be hungry now until much later in the day

No, you're wrong, this is a theatrical mix; I did frequency analysis on the center channel. Have you ever heard the mix on the dvd before ?

It's really not.

The 97 dvd version transmits sound over long distances much more clearly than many theatrical mixes; something a close-range mix could never achieve. If you don't believe it, you can test the differences yourself If you cannot hear a significant difference, your ears are probably damaged.

I have projected near field in a 400 seat cinema.

[kenkenken96]

Hi all
Just wanted to write in that I caught the 35th screening in Aus tonight at reading cinema
Guess what.. they played the CDS AUDIO OMG. There is drums in the opening scene when the first guy gets killed, and I can hear rear echo effects, the shooting in the lift and helicopter under the bridge. 100% not the remixed audio.
The opening text of this 3d version is no longer there, and is replaced with 4K version text. I could see some film grain in there and I think some of the colours were adjusted.
I am wondering, if by some miracle, they do release a new 4K version from this - if they do, then this could be another audio source to compare with from what has been founded thus far.

I hope the third, perfect mix will eventually make it onto a New 4K disc.
They must know that there is demand for the theatrical mix.

[Kado_2020]

The first Seven DVD used the same mix as the laserdiscs which was the near-field mix made for the Criterion by Ren Klyce.

Sering as we're going wildly off track I'll tell everyone what I had for breakfast, a full English. Okay once in a while but I won't be hungry now until much later in the day

No, you're wrong, this is a theatrical mix; I did frequency analysis on the center channel. Have you ever heard the mix on the dvd before ?

It's really not.

The 97 dvd version transmits sound over long distances much more clearly than many theatrical mixes; something a close-range mix could never achieve. If you don't believe it, you can test the differences yourself If you cannot hear a significant difference, your ears are probably damaged.

I have projected near field in a 400 seat cinema.

You should try their seven dvds; the other ac3 dvds i've tried didn't satisfy me but i can't say the same for some dts dvd titles, they were quite impressive.

[dvdmike]

No, you're wrong, this is a theatrical mix; I did frequency analysis on the center channel. Have you ever heard the mix on the dvd before ?

It's really not.

The 97 dvd version transmits sound over long distances much more clearly than many theatrical mixes; something a close-range mix could never achieve. If you don't believe it, you can test the differences yourself If you cannot hear a significant difference, your ears are probably damaged.

I have projected near field in a 400 seat cinema.

You should try their seven dvds; the other ac3 dvds i've tried didn't satisfy me but i can't say the same for some dts dvd titles, they were quite impressive.

None of this belongs in this thread

[izzybell]

Jesus this thread has gotten way off track. Anyways you guys will be happy to know I'm working on syncs for the THX Laserdisc tracks at the moment (Both PCM and AC-3) and I'll post my own findings here when I'm done, said syncs will also be available on my syncs thread for T2. I'm syncing them to the 4K Rutracker Scan first before the 2015 BD because of personal preference.

[PDB]

Jesus this thread has gotten way off track.

I think that's fair to say. Let's keep it on the subject matter.

[izzybell]

Ok so I actually synced those THX tracks not too long after posting that message but it has taken me a few days to get to analyzing them and I don't really have much positive to say about them.

Goes without saying since we already know this but neither of these are the CDS mix, I had assumed it was and even said so in the shoutbox to someone but I will admit upfront I got this one wrong. I'll start with the PCM, I actually don't mind it too much all things considered. It has more bass than the theatrical stereo does and sounds nice. I still prefer the Theatrical stereo from the original LD but this track is more than fine for a remix.


The AC-3 is the one I have the big issues with. It's really quiet and not all that dynamic, its fairly dynamically compressed actually. On top of the already not great volume the AC-3 compression is very audible despite the fact it's frequency cut-off isn't that much worse than the CDS mix on the JP DVD. Lastly the LFE is just pitiful, very little activity with no volume to boot which sucks for a movie like T2. It's overall a very mediocre track to me, the JP DVD packs a much greater punch that this ever could. Do note I had to decode this with BeSync and there's always a possibility the capture I got is faulty but considering the rest of the stuff I've gotten from this guy (david49120) is good I'm fairly certain this is accurate.

[Beber]

What "THX" source is that? Is it the 1998 LD with supposedly the 6-track mix that supposedly has the LFE correctly set to receive the .1 informations?

[FoLLgoTT]

Goes without saying since we already know this but neither of these are the CDS mix, I had assumed it was and even said so in the shoutbox to someone but I will admit upfront I got this one wrong.

I checked both THX Laserdiscs (US and JP) and the drums in the opening scene are clearly audible. So they are at least based on the original mix and not on the one of the "Ultimate Edition".

The AC-3 is the one I have the big issues with. It's really quiet and not all that dynamic, its fairly dynamically compressed actually.

There must be something wrong going on. I decoded both AC-3 tracks of the THX Laserdiscs myself (using BeSplit and EAC3TO) and they are neither compressed nor is the level too low. Please take a look:



In fact, both contain the full dynamic range like all other mixes (including the Ultimate remix). I measured them all (including the D-Theater tape).

And the LFE looks fine. This is how a proper LFE should look like. Please compare the waveforms of the japanese DVD or french HD DVD to the THX Laserdiscs in Audacity. The LFE on these discs is mixed into the surrounds and the LFE channel contains just bass from the front channels. The THX Laserdiscs are the only ones where the LFE and surrounds look similar to the later remix. So I guess, they just fixed the (probably defect) mix of the 1997 DVD.

[izzybell]

If I turn up my decode by 8db I get something close to that (I did that in analyzing just to more properly compare the the JP DVD). I used the BeSplit settings posted by zoidberg here eons ago which are
` BeSplit -core( -input input.wav -output output.ac3 -type ddwav -fix ) ` so unless his settings are wrong IDK what happened.

As for the LFE conundrum: I think it was posted earlier this thread (among the piles of garbage) that according to sound mixing magazine the CDS mix of T2 used something technique to send out of phase information to the surrounds, I think it can be assumed that they might have done something similar with the LFE and derived it from the fronts. This is of course subjective but I also just think the THX LFE is just worse even if it is discrete, the lack of activity in a lot of scenes compared to the CDS mix is a real bummer.