Frankenstein (1931) Audio Preservation

[jerryshadoe]

It appears that's the same source as the 1999 DVD, due to the "frozen" end credits. I forgot to itemize that on my list (been really tired/busy lately) and I have this audio as well, although directly from the DVD and not that re-encoded veoh stream. There is nothing unique about that audio compared to the German BD audio, apart from the fact that it uses a lot less noise reduction.

[crissrudd4554]

The 2004 DVD also uses the frozen end credits. Weird also that a couple of the black outs (scene transitions) are shortened on this print.

[jerryshadoe]

It's not weird at all. In most cases, the reason for the different lengths is due to the fact that they are around reel changes. I see this all the time when doing audio syncing work, especially with older films and/or with foreign dub tracks (which also makes sense, since they would be coming from a different transfer/print)

[crissrudd4554]

Its possible that print may also be a rerelease print. That print was also used on the 1999 VHS yet a B&W variant of the 1963-1990 Universal logo is at the beginning of the film. The AMC airing I mentioned before also has this.

[jerryshadoe]

So, before I decided to write everything by hand on paper (because it was so much faster) I started itemizing some of the differences between the English LD PCM synced to BD track and the dubs... For those interested, here is a PARTIAL list of some of the differences I noticed in the first few minutes:

timecodes legend: hours/minutes/seconds/frames

00min 02.20 - 00min 04.00 - footsteps can be heard on the Italian and French dubs only

00min 06.09 - 00min 10.10 - again, the footsteps

00min 59.08 - 01min 01.06 - again, the footsteps

01min 15.12 - 01min 18.07 - this part of music is mixed just slightly differently timing-wise

01min 19.21 - 01min 22.12 - again, music mixed and timed a little different

02min 02.13 - 02min 07.05 - here, ONLY on Spanish dub (Italian has this Latin part dubbed into Italian) the prayer (or whatever) starts as the music is nearly faded out, there is a couple more words and it seems to flow smoother. On the English track, it sounds like there is a skip when we first here "Done i Donime." The tracks resync automatically. The way the line of dialog starts now syncs perfectly with the video, that you hear the bells just as the scene fades from black. Although, I discover that the reason the audio is re-timed on the English version (and most other dubs) is because they were clearly missing nearly 2 seconds of audio here. (I googled the prayer being used there and it's clear that a snippet of it is missing)

03min 04.16 - the footstep is muffled by the bell on the LD, but on the dubs you can clearly make out both

03min 06.13 - the sound of the hat dropping on the ground is muffled by the footstep on the LD, but on the dubs you can clearly make out both

03min 13.09 - 03min 13.20 - after the sound of the bell, on the dubs there is what sounds like a whistle in the background (not sure if this belongs and there is nothing onscreen to give me any idea)

03min 27.02 - 03min 27.12 - here, right after the clanking sound and before we hear the shoe kicking the dirt, there is a chunk of audio missing on the LD containing the sound of "moving gravel" that does actually belong there which I visually confirmed... the LD contained an audio drop-out here

03min 29.03 - 03min 29.18 - here, all where hear is the bell and then the sound of the gravel thudding on the coffin on the LD, what's missing is the sound of the shoe dragging the dirt - visually confirmed as well

03min 54.03 - 03min 54.09 - here, just as the guy is lifting his jacket, there is a "clanking" (or something) sound effect that is not on the LD (EDIT: I'm actually about to get to this spot after I finish this post)

03min 55.17 - 03min 55.21 - here the footstep is extremely muffled (by the noise on source) on the LD audio, but is crystal clear on the dubs

03min 57.23 - 03min 58.02 - here the sound effect is cut off midway on the LD, although it doesn't seem like it until you hear them side by side with the dubs

04min 17.18 - 04min 32.20 here, at the shot change, we start hearing a little foley (chirping crickets) on the dubs until the sounds of the shovels digging dirt

04min 18.14 - 04min 19.06 - here, you can clearly hear the footsteps on the dubs, but on the LD they are extremely muffled by noise and scratches

04min 22.08 - 04min 23.13 - here the audio on the LD is partially missing, because all we hear in the sound of the shovel being thrown by Fritz... what's missing is Henry's footsteps and the sound of his shovel being thrown which is on the dubs

04min 48.12 -04min 48.18 - here, amongst all the clanking by Fritz and the sound effect of Henry hitting the gravel with his shovel, the sound of the gravel being moved by Fritz is missing on the LD, but present on the dubs

04min 59.16 05min 00.00 - here, the sound effect of the casket moving in the dirt is partially missing on the LD (sounds like a film splice, where those frames are missing) but it's all there on the dubs

05min 01.20 - 05min 02.04 - here, we can hear the first light sound effect of the dirt being moved by the casket, but the second one is missing on LD due to another drop-out, but present on dubs

05min 03.11 - 05min 03.20 - here, the sound of Fritz hitting the shovel with his hand is missing on the LD, but present on the dubs

05min 05.02 - 05min 05.06 - here, right at the shot change to a close up of Henry hitting the casket with his left hand while rubbing it with his right, on the LD there is a glitch here and the audio is just a loud noise, on the dubs you can clearly hear Henry tapping the casket with his left hand

05min 05.07 - 05min 06.18 - right after the noise on the LD, there is silence right until we hear Henry say "He's resting," but on the dubs you can hear the sound of Henry moving and very light tapping of his right hand on the casket, along with the sound of Fritz moving the shovel offscreen

05min 08.21 - 05min 10.01 - here, we can hear the bell ring on the dubs but it's missing on the LD, although when Henry says "...new life to come," when can very faintly here the ending of the bell sound (you gotta amplify it a lot, but it's there)

05min 17.02 - 05min 17.20 - amongst all the sound effects there, the sound of a bell is missing on the LD just before scene crossfade, but is present on both dubs

05min 27.07 - 05min 27.12 - there is a sound effect of the rolling wheel that is missing on the LD, but present on the dubs (on the LD, there is an obvious drop-out here due to missing frames)

05min 30.00 - 06min 39.00 - this is where the foley starts again on the dub, where in the background we hear crickets chirping, a couple of birds chirp, and an owl hooting (the only part that is contained on the LD, is the dog barking in the background around 5min 40sec) and it continues until the end of the scene where it fades to black with Henry onscreen

05min 34.21 - 05min 35.12 - here, the sound effect of the wheelbarrel creaking right before we hear the thudd of it hitting the ground is missing on the LD (again, looks like missing frames because there is a dead silence there) but it's present on dubs

05min 36.08 - 05min 36.18 - here, the sound effect on the wheelbarrel hitting the ground is incomplete on the LD and just turns to dead silence, but it's included in full on the dubs

05min 37.16 - here, at the shot change, if you listen very carefully (with the track amplified) you can make out a very muffled cricket chirp on the LD(!) that has the EXACT SAME timing as on the dub, where it can be heard clearly which confirms my suspiscions that this foley was, in fact, originally on the English version and was NOT removed prior to release. It just looks like, over the years, they lost a LOT of the original audio stems and there is a good chance that it didn't survive because they stripped it for the first re-release when the film was massively censored. It was in the middle of the depression, they were probobly limited on funds or whatever and with the censorship, I can also understand why some of the music was removed because it sets a very grim mood.

05min 37.20 - 05min 38.16 - here, on the LD there is a drop-out and some vinyl scratch sounds, while on the dubs you can hear light footsteps which sync with whats on screen

05min 46.00 - 05min 46.18 - here, on the LD there is dead silence, while on the dubs where hear a clanking sound of the lamp Fritz is holding swaying back and forth and we hear the sound of the cane that Fritz is holding touching the dirt (visualy matches whats onscreen)

05min 47.12 - 05min 47.18 - again, dead silence on LD, while on dubs where hear that clanking sound again and it matches whats on screen

05min 49.20 - 05min 50.00 - here, on the LD there is a spike in noise only, while on the dubs, we hear that clank once again as Fritz makes his first step. again, this matches what's onscreen

05min 53.18 - 05min 53.23 - here, again, on the LD there is dead silence, where on the dubs we hear the clanking sounds of the lamp swaying in Henry's hand while he's handing Fritz the knife... and again this matches what's on screen prefectly

05min 55.16 - 05min 55.20 - here, on the LD there is dead silence, while on the dubs we hear a very slight wooden thud of the body that's swinging

05min 56.22 - 05min 57.02 - exact same as the last one

05min 57.03 - 05min 57.08 - here, the sound of the lamp swinging is actually present on the LD and Italian dub but missing on the Spanish dub, LOL

05min 58.03 - 05min 58.08 - here on the LD there's dead silence, while on the dubs there is a wooden thud sound when we see the body swaying, just as Fritz touches the wooden post

06min 06.10 - 06min 06.18 - here, at the shot change to Fritz climbing the wooden post, on the LD there's dead silence, while on the dubs there is a wooden sound again that corresponds to Fritz swaying the post back and forth a little as he's climbing up and matches onscreen perfect

06min 07.21 - 06min 08.10 - here, again on the LD there is just a dead silence, while on the dubs we can hear the sound of the wood creaking as Fritz is swinging his left foot up to the top... after this, they all auto-sync with the sound of Fritz hitting the wood with his left foot when he puts it on top of the mast thing

06min 13.10 - 06min 13.15 - there is dead silence on the LD here and then the sound effect of Fritz moving on that wooden post cuts in half-way through it. on the dubs, the entire sound effect is present

06min 14.17 - 06min 16.08 - here, on all of them you can hear Fritz breathing loud and the sound of his hands rubbing on the wood, the dubs also contain a wooden creaking effect that matches the movement of the wood Fritz is on top of perfectly onscreen... all tracks "auto-sync" at the "metallic" wooden thump sound effect right after this

06min 17.15 - 06min 17.20 - here, on the dubs there is another wooden thud, creaking sound effect that matches whats on screen, but it's missing on the LD

06min 19.02 - 06min 19.06 - here, on the LD where hear Fritz yelling "Look out" while on the dubs there is another wooden creak sound effect (in between the words "look" and "out) that corresponds with Fritz movement on the wooden post

06min 20.14 - 06min 20.12 - here, on the LD there is dead silence (it's right after we hear the sound of Fritz cutting the rope and before we hear the thud of the body on the ground) while on the dubs there is a sound effect of the falling body

06min 21.15 - 06min 22.03 - here, on the LD there is a vinyl scratch and drop-out, while on the dubs we can hear the sound of Henry scrapping his right foot back on the dirt before he takes his first step

06min 22.06 - 06min 22.11 - here, on the LD there is an obvious audio drop-out, while on the dubs we can clearly hear the sound of Henry's right footstep as it touches the ground

06min 26.06 - 06min 29.00 - here, the initial sound of the wood creaking and the sound of Fritz jumping down is 10 frames late on the LD (they tried to match it with Fritz appearing onscreen, but there is a clear mis-match in sound effect there, while on the dubs this sounds correct) next, on the LD, after that there is a slight audio drop-out and then when we see Fritz kneeling down, the sound effect there is actually of creaking wood if you listen real carefully and it's obvious that the part was spliced in due to massive audio quality change and it being out-of-sync; on the dubs, the initial timing is correct and the original sound effects of Fritz's movement are present and match what's onscreen prefectly. The tracks all "auto-sync" at the shot change to a closeup of Fritz's face

06min 31.18 - 06min 53.06 - here, on the dubs, just as the camera moves from Fritz to Henry and we hear Henry say, "the neck is broken" there is a musical cue which is a transition from one scene to the next and lasts until we see the two guys in white coats cover the feet of the corpse on the table. The audio indicates that it was there originally (and not added digitally later) due to the way it sounds at the actual frame where the shot change occurs.

06min 56.03 - 06min 59.00 - here, on the LD the footsteps switch to noise (like when you first put a needle on a vinyl record before music plays) and stays that way until we hear laughter. on the dubs, we continue to hear the same footsteps and we also hear the sound of the bones clanking on the skeleton when the guy bumps into them

07min 00.00 - 07min 06.11 - here, on the LD, the entire crowd laughter sound effect is NOT the original, although it's kinda similar. At first I thought it was just a timing issue, but that's not it either. On the dub, (Spanish ONLY) the original laughter is included as it matches perfectly to the movements of lungs/chests to the laughter heard and it follows what's on-screen correctly

07min 06.11 - 07min 10.00 - here, on the LD, there is a dead silence, whereas on the dubs you can hear the sound of Fritz's left hand touching the window frame (personal note: just this part needs to be moved back by 20frames to keep sync)

07min 30.16 - 07min 30.18 - here, on the dub (Spanish only) you can hear the sound of the pencil tap on the glass jar (perfectly synced) and seemed like an "organic" original sound effect.



So yeah, this should give you an idea of some of the initial steps. Of course, this list doesn't express how much of a pain splicing in the music segment will be, since there is dialog there that I have to "patch" in order to remove it before I use it with the English audio... And, this is just the first few minutes...

[crissrudd4554]

Wow thats quite a list and we're not even 10 minutes into the film! Im both anxious and afraid on what you prepare for the rest of film. You saying this could take a long time? You aint kidding. But I am excited tochear what will probably be close to the films theatrical mix!

[jerryshadoe]

Yeah, that's only a partial list and the actual amount of splices is much higher...

The reason this is gonna take me a minute (I wish it was only a minute, LMAO) even though I have a list of changes, is because I still have to make sure everything syncs properly, choose the right source for each splice and then try to blend it all seamlessly. So far, the process has been successful and I can't detect where the audio switches from source to source... but it is a slow, tedious process. For example, within the last three hours, I have only completed ONE extra minute of audio(!) Will it all be this difficult? Fortunately not. There are stretches of time here and there, (ranging from 30-75seconds) where nothing needs to be modified or it's extremely minor/easy type of fix.

Now, it's time for me to get some sleep because my vision is blurring and if I keep working on anything right now, it will be riddled with mistakes... Got a full day worth of sh*t to do tomorrow, but hope to get some more done in the evening. Oh, and as an FYI, I will have to take a day break from this some time this week, to do a simple audio sync job for a friend on a different project. Thankfully, it's only a 20 minute sample and it looks like it will be straight-forward... but I wanted to mention this, since it will delay me an extra day from finishing this project. Realistically, this Frankenstein project has put the brakes on almost all of my other projects for a moment and I'm looking forward to finishing it, so I can finish up some of my other stuff which will free up about a terabyte of storage that I have tied up in temp files

[Lil Brutto]

3h effort for 1 minute??? Holy $hit. Take that much needed - and deserved - break, buddy

[captainsolo]

Whoa. That's a lion's share of work there.

But I have to say that I'm not surprised in the slightest. I think all the classic Unis need this level of proper work and research done, but of them Frank and Drac will be the hardest to work with for a multitude of reasons. They were the oldest, most reprinted, most edited for post 1934 Code censorship, on older stocks, treated poorly, and exist in a multitude of both sound and picture versions. AFAIK the optical discs they used were similar to Warner's Vitaphone discs and are extremely harsh and compromised in dynamic range. And the optical tracks of the day would be not much better. Plus there were silent versions released for both films for outlying territories. Also a silent version of Frankenstein was apparently released complete with intertitles and green tints added to many scenes to match the Creature's pallor. I am not making this up.

So needless to say this combined with the lack of hardcore research on Uni's part makes for a gigantic headache-especially for those of us on the outside piecing all this together. That the foreign dubs exist in better AQ is probably spot on, as they would have been nice flat transfers from better elements back in the day without any NR or EQing-just as repeated shots from the original film in BRIDE and other sequels are generally in better shape than the original.

I hate to say it, but I REALLY think all the classics need to be looked at. As great as it is to finally have them on BD (and more are on the way as they should be), they aren't perfect by any means. Jerry made a good point that by removing or lessening the "audio defects" this time around they actually made things worse or more manipulated especially when combined with the EQing and post processing that is going on. They should have gone back and used a new untouched scan of the optical and disc masters for the first two and done it right from the ground up instead of half-assing it in ProTools as they always do.

Glad to hear you're doing all right Jerry!

[crissrudd4554]

Spot on man!! This is what I meant a few posts back when I said I really cant bring myself to say Universal were careful in ALL departments when doing the BD restorations. I understand that the sources can deteriorate over time but the fact that Universal arent even examining additional sources like we are is sad. Will this change? Who knows? But this further extends my appreciation and concern for film preservation. If they cant save it we will! Anyways check this out. Its an original Frankenstein sound disc used for theatres that werent equipped for sound (no not for sale or anything).

https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hph...e=578C4ABA