(2026-08-26, 03:23 PM)FoLLgoTT Wrote: I analyzed the AC-3 track of the Laserdisc (LD68952-2DD) and the DTS track of the japanese DVD with my new tool AnalyzeDynamicRange and Audacity. The LFE of the jap DVD is defect. It contains only the low-pass-filtered signal of the front channels.
The LD on the other side has a LFE track with dedicated and isolated effects. Its content looks similar to that of the new mix (BD/UHD BD). So I assume that the Laserdisc is correct.

The live DVD seems to be defective, too, as stated in this thread. Can someone check the HD DVD?

The difference can be easily detected by looking at the waveform. The defective LFE has low amplitude, but overall more activity which correlates with the front channels. The correct LFE has high amplitude, but less activity (more isolated effects). Additionally the spectrum of the defective LFE has a higher upper frequency (about 100 Hz vs. 50 Hz).

It's not defect. The lfe is also set to 100 Hz, similar to cds mixes. The lfe information is encoded into the rear channels. If I recall correctly, the dts audio on the Speed laserdisc was mixed this way as well.

I checked out of curiosity, and on page 18 of the Mix magazine, they specified the 100 Hz limit for the cds lfe

https://www.worldradiohistory.com/Archiv...990-09.pdf

The Speed laserdiscs were also defective, they used the DTS printmaster which had already folded the LFE/subwoofer into the surrounds. Low-passing the surrounds produces a LFE track in exactly the same way the foobar APT-X100 plugin does.
If the LFE information remains in the surrounds during playback the output will be too low relative to the other channels by at least 10dB.

@bendermac the mix on the D-VHS will be the Rydstrom 6.1 remix.

(2026-09-03, 11:10 PM)zoidberg Wrote: @bendermac the mix on the D-VHS will be the Rydstrom 6.1 remix.

Are you sure? .... Looks like 5.1 to me.

File Size Processed: 23.17 GB, Play Time: 02h:17m:16s
1920 x 1080, 29.97 fps, 45.00 Mbps (22.95 Mbps Average).
Average Video Quality: 93.46 KB/Frame, 0.37 Bits/Pixel.
AC3 Audio: 3/2 Channels (L, C, R, SL, SR) + LFE, 48.0 kHz, 576 kbps.
Dialog Normalization: -27.0 dB, Center Mix Level: -3.0 dB, Surround Mix Level: -3.0 dB

Yeah, but that never was real 6.1, I believe: it was Dolby 5.1 EX and DTS 5.1 ES, so matrix and not discrete.

Yes I should have been clearer, I meant 5.1EX, I don't think it was fully discrete until one of the blu ray releases.

(2026-09-03, 11:10 PM)zoidberg Wrote: The Speed laserdiscs were also defective, they used the DTS printmaster which had already folded the LFE/subwoofer into the surrounds. Low-passing the surrounds produces a LFE track in exactly the same way the foobar APT-X100 plugin does.
If the LFE information remains in the surrounds during playback the output will be too low relative to the other channels by at least 10dB.

@bendermac the mix on the D-VHS will be the Rydstrom 6.1 remix.

I listened to the Seven (1995) Cinema DTS and 1997 DVD audio mixes. The DVD's AC3 audio has much better tonality and depth of detail (12% better overall).

The dialogue, foley effects, ambiance, and detail extension in the DVD's 5.1 mix are even better than in Terminator 2. I've never heard such realistic rain sounds before.

The first Seven DVD used the same mix as the laserdiscs which was the near-field mix made for the Criterion by Ren Klyce.

Sering as we're going wildly off track I'll tell everyone what I had for breakfast, a full English. Okay once in a while but I won't be hungry now until much later in the day

(2026-09-04, 12:45 PM)zoidberg Wrote: The first Seven DVD used the same mix as the laserdiscs which was the near-field mix made for the Criterion by Ren Klyce.

Sering as we're going wildly off track I'll tell everyone what I had for breakfast, a full English. Okay once in a while but I won't be hungry now until much later in the day

No, you're wrong, this is a theatrical mix; I did frequency analysis on the center channel. Have you ever heard the mix on the dvd before ?

Cinema DTS is a little more dynamic, but the overall sound tonality of the DVD ac3 far surpasses it, allowing the sound to be transmitted much more clearly over long distances, something a close-range mix could never achieve. Don't fall for fake marketing tricks

um...wtf