[versions] Jacob's Ladder

[pipefan413]

Finally looking at the .wav files from the UK Blu-ray and the US LaserDisc. At first glance, the spectrogram on the Blu-ray seems a little better than the LaserDisc...



... But then I started spot-checking it. It seems like the Blu-ray is a remix with increased separation, perhaps a new custom mixdown of the 4-track master or of the 5.1 track that's on the same UK Blu-ray as this 2.0 track (it might not even be matrix encoded, but simply included for people who only have 2 speakers rather than 5.1 or more). It certainly isn't the same as the LaserDisc's stereo track!

At many of the moments I listened to, sounds are pushed further to the left or right in the mix rather than being closer to centre. Sounds are also more or less prominent from time to time, the sonic profile differs somewhat, and the dynamic range is occasionally neutered compared to the LD (though in other moments it's increased as well). Here's a pretty extreme example of all of those things happening around the same time:



The explosion at the start of this sample is more impactful on the LD, the sound of something being dropped onto a hard surface is hard-panned to the right on the Blu-ray but on the LD lands dead centre, gunfire sounds are different (almost inaudible) on the Blu-ray in places, and so on. Hear what I'm talking about...

BD: https://mega.nz/file/dkZGVbJK#Z2rP62ZmLf...mGE37Sjur8
LD: https://mega.nz/file/xoQGHbpQ#kExfuCev1Z...COyL5wyFLY

There are times that the Blu-ray does sound a little clearer and has a healthier high freqency response, but I suspect that might just be because the LD is the 35 mm Dolby Stereo mix (with the limitations to headroom that you get on optical stereo) and the Blu-ray is a newer mix made from the master. There's a 5.0 mix on the Blu-ray as well, however, and I'm wondering if perhaps that could be the pre-matrix-encoding 4-track master rendered out to separate tracks, so I'll have a listen to that as well. EDIT: No, Blu-ray.com is wrong... the disc actually has a 5.1 track which does sound a lot like it's the same content as the 2.0 but rendered out discretely. The German Blu-ray has a 5.1 mix instead, which I also haven't looked at yet (but I do have a retail copy of that release as well now).

EDIT: Given that it turns out that both the UK and German Blu-rays have a 5.1 mix that sounds different to the LaserDisc's 2-track PCM, I'm thinking that perhaps the LaserDisc is the actual Dolby Stereo mix rendered out for Dolby Surround purposes (so still matrix encoded but having gone through a Dolby SR decoder to remove Dolby pre-emphasis) whereas the 2.0 track on the UK Blu-ray (which isn't on the German Blu-ray, by the way) is just a mixdown of the 5.1 track from the UK Blu-ray, which is presumably a modern remix. The 2.0 Blu-ray track is linear PCM and seems to have a lot of left/right separation, looks quite different from the LaserDisc track, and I think probably isn't matrix encoded at all but rather might be plain L+R (as opposed to Lt+Rt matrixed) for people who don't have 5.1 setups. So I'm going to go ahead and resync the LaserDisc track to the German Blu-ray Disc.

[alexpeden2000]

Interesting! I compared them a little while ago (not anywhere near he extent you have though) and certainly heard the better high-end on the BR. However, if the LD is actaully more theatrically accurate (as they almost always seem to be) them I'm all in favour of using that.

[Turisu]

Are we sure that the BD has the incorrect geometry? Here the headlights on the DVD appear stretched whereas on the BD they are circular:

https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?a=1&x=452...&i=13&go=1

[pipefan413]

Are we sure that the BD has the incorrect geometry? Here the headlights on the DVD appear stretched whereas on the BD they are circular:

https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?a=1&x=452...&i=13&go=1

It might be that the truth lies somewhere in between, or that it varies from scene to scene. But there are definitely some moments that look decidedly wrong to me on the Blu-ray. I think when I had a look at it I ended up deciding that the DVD was perhaps slightly *too* tall, the LaserDisc was somewhere in the middle, and the Blu-ray was a bit too wide. But if it varies depending on the shot then it's anybody's guess... and I have absolutely no idea how it would've looked on a pristine 35 mm print, because I've only ever seen this film on home video. *shrugs*

(The version I've watched all the way through the most times is the UK DVD, which I don't have any more, because of course Blu-rays are meant to be better so I sold it for like 50p or something years ago. That old chestnut... So I have no idea if that has a similar look to the DVD or not.)

[alexpeden2000]

Hi Pipefan,

Just wondering if this is one you're working on/planning to work on?

[LucasGodzilla]

What are y'all's thoughts on the 35mm trailer footage up online in terms of colors?

I don't think they reflect how the movie was actually timed if Pipefan's hunch is correct and Hitcher's memory is right, but it's certainly an interesting look in the least with its predominant sickly green hue. I do wonder though if they would make a decent color reference once blanket-balanced to neutral though.