Thanks, Evit for sharing the DTS DVD track. It's an interesting one. The 5 main channels are identical to the AC3 track but the LFE channel has been completely revamped.

The 5.1 tracks from every other release from LD to DDE have the same sparse LFE channel (only the levels differ). This is typical of early 90's theatrical mixes. But this DTS LFE channel is entirely unique with prominent LFE throughout the movie more akin to a modern mix. I'd guess that the LFE was re-done in order to make the DTS edition sound 'better' than its AC3 counterpart (because we all know that more low-end = better!).

So, while I'm certain this isn't the theatrical mix, it's nonetheless a significant entry in this movie's audio history.

Sounds like something that this company Cecchigori would do. So the AC3 is the actual "authentic" mix, and DTS has been tweaked? I'm gonna have to check all other DVDs from the same company!

Does the DVD ac3 sync with the older Blu-ray? I’m thinking they’d likely be the same transfer

(2022-02-23, 07:10 PM)alexpeden2000 Wrote: Does the DVD ac3 sync with the older Blu-ray? I’m thinking they’d likely be the same transfer

Impossible. DVD is theatrical cut, Blu-ray is recut in the "detritus" scene between Pacino and Venora.

I still submit that the R1 DVD AC3 is the most likely contender for the original theatrical mix based on the fact that it has the most dynamic centre channel. All other tracks (including this Italian DVD) have the centre channel boosted to some degree with dynamic range and/or peaks compromised.

(2022-02-23, 08:44 PM)Beber Wrote:

(2022-02-23, 07:10 PM)alexpeden2000 Wrote: Does the DVD ac3 sync with the older Blu-ray? I’m thinking they’d likely be the same transfer

Impossible. DVD is theatrical cut, Blu-ray is recut in the "detritus" scene between Pacino and Venora.

Is it actually cut in terms of frames though? I thought it was just the dialogue (which is a voiceover) that was cut

(2022-02-23, 09:26 PM)alleycat Wrote:

(2022-02-23, 08:44 PM)Beber Wrote:

(2022-02-23, 07:10 PM)alexpeden2000 Wrote: Does the DVD ac3 sync with the older Blu-ray? I’m thinking they’d likely be the same transfer

Impossible. DVD is theatrical cut, Blu-ray is recut in the "detritus" scene between Pacino and Venora.

It's also missing a short shot during the robbery.

Odd that the Germans from movie-censorship didn't notice that. They are usually VERY precise. https://www.movie-censorship.com/report.php?ID=718791

(2022-02-23, 09:26 PM)alleycat Wrote: It's also missing a short shot during the robbery.

Hadn’t heard of this before, I thought it was the ‘detritus’ and ‘ferocious’ lines that were cut?

(2022-02-23, 10:06 PM)Evit Wrote:

(2022-02-23, 09:26 PM)alleycat Wrote:

(2022-02-23, 08:44 PM)Beber Wrote:

(2022-02-23, 07:10 PM)alexpeden2000 Wrote: Does the DVD ac3 sync with the older Blu-ray? I’m thinking they’d likely be the same transfer

Impossible. DVD is theatrical cut, Blu-ray is recut in the "detritus" scene between Pacino and Venora.

It's also missing a short shot during the robbery.

Odd that the Germans from movie-censorship didn't notice that. They are usually VERY precise. https://www.movie-censorship.com/report.php?ID=718791

(2022-02-23, 10:09 PM)alexpeden2000 Wrote:

(2022-02-23, 09:26 PM)alleycat Wrote: It's also missing a short shot during the robbery.

Hadn’t heard of this before, I thought it was the ‘detritus’ and ‘ferocious’ lines that were cut?

Ignore me. I was syncing my project to the LD frame by frame and I was missing this 14 frame shot in the robbery, just could not find it in the blu ray. But I had to cut the blu up into multiple parts so it was more manageable and then put them back together afterwards, so I'm guessing it went missing at some point during one of those cuts. Anyway I just went back to the raw blu ray files and it's there. So it is just the detritus and ferocious cuts in the blu. And the time I spent upscaling and cleaning the DVD for that 14 frame shot was all for nothing

So the DVD audio works without problems on the BD?