Here's a very quick one for you. (Not like me, eh?)

Working on this today. Just watched the film with the audio that's on the disc, which actually was pretty good overall (not anything particularly incredible, but a pretty pleasing mix to listen to on my system in any case). But then it got to a dramatic moment near the end of the film and *this* happened...

Hello people from Syberia, Russia!

I'm a movie fan for as long as I can remember.
I'm a big fan of horror movies.
But I'm a big fan of movies based on Stephen King novels much more.

I'm brand new here and glad to be a part of this forum.

Before I start, this is not about the home video version of DTS, which is actually called DCA (for DTS Coherent Acoustics). It's specifically about the DTS cinema codec, which is APTX-100 (or APT-X100, depending on where you look). Just in case anybody gets confused by them both being "DTS".

I'm writing this mostly to solidify some stuff that I only even thought about thanks to @schorman noticing that the levels of the surround and subwoofer channels from the output from the foobar2000 APTX-100 plugin did not match those from an actual DTS-6AD cinema processor that he has fairly recently tested. A huge amount of credit therefore has to go to him here, since I wouldn't even be looking at it otherwise, and the information gleaned from testing the DTS-6AD was instrumental to a lot of what I'm about to say, including the actual numbers for the foobar2000 plugin (which I just verified after he worked them out, rather than realising them on my own). I'm just compiling the info here in case anybody else might benefit from it.

This will be a very long post (surprise surprise). In case you don't really care about ther "why" and just want to know the "how", I'll give you the TL;DR up front.

The foobar2000 APTX-100 plugin does not calibrate the relative levels of its output in accordance with the DTS cinema standards. To correct for this, you need to reduce the gain of the surround channels by 3 dB, and increase the gain of the subwoofer channel by either 3 dB or 6 dB depending on the original release date of the particular film you're decoding. Films released on or after the 1st of January 1999 need the subwoofer level increased by 6 dB, and films released before then only need it increased by 3 dB.

If you're using the current version of the plugin, you can correct the subwoofer level natively inside foobar2000 (but not the surrounds). Go to File\Preferences\Advanced\Tools and you'll see the settings for the APTX-100 plugin. Change "LFE level" to your 3 dB or 6 dB, depending on the film's release date.

For the surrounds, you could do this one of two ways. The first way would be to reduce the surrounds directly by applying a manual gain adjustment of -3 dB to each of them and dithering appropriately, which in my opinion should always involve auto-blanking so you don't dither silence (this is particularly important if you're going to encode to DTS-HD MA for delivery because it won't decode properly if the file doesn't have clean silence at the start of all channels). The other way would be to just have your encoder reduce the surrounds by 3 dB, which you can do in the DTS Suite and probably many other encoders very easily by just flipping a switch!

That said, I'll move onto the "why", for the curious...

APTX-100 does not actually store every channel at the "correct" level per se, but rather in accordance with a set of guidelines for calibrating them to your particular theatre. This is not really taken into account by the APTX-100 Winamp or foobar2000 decoder plugins, which (by default at least) just decode it as it is, leaving the levels as they're stored. This is not necessarily inherently "wrong" as such, but for things like fan projects that utilise cinema DTS audio, you're not quite reproducing the sound as it was meant to be reproduced if you don't correct for this calibration at delivery. All I'm going to explain here is how a cinema screening room is calibrated for DTS and how this relates to decoding it for alternative purposes, but it's important to note that a living room is not going to be kitted out the same way as a cinema (generally speaking), nor is it likely to be the same size, so these calibrations won't necessarily produce "appropriate" results for home use. They are, however, correct to how it was done in the cinema.

Basically everything I'm about to say from this point onward comes from either the November 1999 version of the DTS post production guide (http://www.film-tech.com/warehouse/manua...STPROD.pdf) or the operation manual for the DTS-6AD cinema processor (http://www.film-tech.com/warehouse/manuals/DTS6AD.pdf). I'll quote both, but you might find other things in there interesting as well.

First off, here are the guidelines for correctly calibrating a cinema for 6-track DTS from 1999 onwards:

DTS-6AD CINEMA PROCESSOR Installation and Operation Manual (March 1 2000) Wrote:5.3.1 SPL ADJUSTMENT

(...)

• Repeat procedure for all channels, set to the following SPLs:
  
  Left, Center, Right 85 dBC
  Left & Right Surrounds: 82 dBC
  Subwoofer: * 85 dBC
  
  * NOTE: The above levels are for use with the internal pink noise generator. When playing back a DTS Set-up or Empirical Disc, the subwoofer level should be 91 dBC. This setting conforms the subwoofer level to the SMPTE RP200 standard of having +10dB in-band gain in relation to the screen channels.
  

(...)

5.3.4. DTS SUBWOOFER LEVEL

(...)

• If a RTA is not available, the DTS subwoofer can be measured using a SPL meter.  The SPLmeter must be set for “C” weighting and “slow.” It should read about 91 dBC when the (DTS Setup Disc) subwoofer pink noise is playing in theater. Take measurements in different areas ofthe auditorium to prevent subwoofer from being adjusted too loud.
  

DTS-6AD CINEMA PROCESSOR Installation and Operation Manual (March 1 2000) Wrote:5.3.3. DTS DIGITAL SURROUND SIGNALS

With the RTA connected, notice a dramatic roll-off at 80Hz. DTS derives the digital subwoofer by filtering out the surround signals from 80Hz and below. This is normal when in the DTS digital format and surround pink noise is playing in the theater.

DTS POST PRODUCTION GUIDE TM-E229 (19 November 1999) Wrote:Subject: SMPTE RP200 changes DTS subwoofer level (REVISED), August 1999

At a SMPTE meeting held in late 1998, all three digital sound companies agreed to comply with the recommended practice for subwoofer level, SMPTE RP200. The subwoofer level has changed to enable the use of one master recording when transferring to all three digital sound processes and to provide playback consistency in theaters. As of January 1, 1999, the recorded subwoofer level on 6-track masters has been lowered to the SMPTE recommended level of 10dB in-band gain (as compared to the screen channels).

To comply with this new standard, all DTS films released in North America after January 1, 1999 have been transferred into the DTS digital process with subwoofer at 10dB in-band gain. The SMPTE RP200 logo is clearly visible on the discs of these films.

Because the recorded subwoofer level has been lowered, the DTS theater subwoofer playback should be increased. Increasing the DTS subwoofer level compensates for the new lowered recording level, resulting in the same playback as before the change. To maintain the integrity of the cinema sound equipment, DTS discs of pre 1999 films should be played only after the subwoofer playback level has been restored to the previous 88 dBC level.

Technicians should follow these steps

Equipment needed: DTS Setup Disc, DS1 or Rev. C

1. Verify the cinema processor is correctly calibrated. Follow the manufacturer’s recommendations for proper playback levels (when using a DTS-6AD, see 4. Below).
2. Using the DTS Setup Disc, adjust the DTS output levels as normal: L, C, R to 85dB SPL and surround(s) to 82 dB SPL* in the theater.
3. Adjust the DTS-6 or DTS-6D subwoofer to 91dBC SPL in the theater.
4. When adjusting the output of the DTS-6AD Cinema Processor using the internal pink noise generator, adjust the DTS subwoofer to 85dBC SPL in the theater.

NOTE
* It is recommended that the subwoofer amplifier be turned off during the surround level adjustments. Turn the subwoofer amp back on after the surround levels have been set.

DTS POST PRODUCTION GUIDE TM-E229 (19 November 1999) Wrote:4. When adjusting the output of the DTS-6AD Cinema Processor using the internal pink noise generator, adjust the DTS subwoofer to 85dBC SPL in the theater.

DTS-6AD CINEMA PROCESSOR Installation and Operation Manual (March 1 2000) Wrote:5.3.1 SPL ADJUSTMENT

(...)

• Repeat procedure for all channels, set to the following SPLs:
  
  Left, Center, Right 85 dBC
  Left & Right Surrounds: 82 dBC
  Subwoofer: * 85 dBC
  
  * NOTE: The above levels are for use with the internal pink noise generator. When playing back a DTS Set-up or Empirical Disc, the subwoofer level should be 91 dBC. This setting conforms the subwoofer level to the SMPTE RP200 standard of having +10dB in-band gain in relation to the screen channels.
  

(...)

5.3.4. DTS SUBWOOFER LEVEL

(...)

• If a RTA is not available, the DTS subwoofer can be measured using a SPL meter.  The SPLmeter must be set for “C” weighting and “slow.” It should read about 91 dBC when the (DTS Setup Disc) subwoofer pink noise is playing in theater. Take measurements in different areas ofthe auditorium to prevent subwoofer from being adjusted too loud.
  

gregorio Wrote:85dBC is the level measured with an SPL meter with the main/screen speaker outputting 20Hz-20kHz pink noise (at -20dBFS). Our LFE is level calibrated to +10dB
in-band gain relative to our main/screen speaker. The "In-band" part means that our LFE/Sub should be outputting 10dB more 20Hz-120Hz than the amount of 20-120Hz our main speaker is outputting. The issue should hopefully now be obvious, our main speaker is not outputting 85dBC of 20Hz-120Hz, it's outputting 85dBC of 20Hz-20kHz. If we remove the 121Hz-20kHz output of our main speaker (so that it's only outputting our required 20Hz-120Hz), it's output level will obviously be lower, it will be approx 81dBSPL and our sub is then calibrated 10dB higher, which is about 91dB. In practice, we wouldn't try and "remove the 121-20kHz", we'd just use an RTA to measure the 20Hz-120Hz portion of the main speaker's output. In other words, your equation should read: "85dBC - (the 121Hz -20kHz band) +10dB = 91dB".

After Barry Lyndon, I decided to give the other Kubricks a try. And my next preservation will be the German version of...

Hi everyone!

     I originally posted this in the wrong area of the forum so my apologies about that! Hopefully this is in the right place now. I am currently working on a resync of Halloween 4: The Return of Michael Myers and I could use some help. The current DVD and Blu-Ray releases of this film use a terrible 5.1 remix that sounds puny, goes in and out of sync throughout the film AND is missing sound effects in various portions as well. I think they were drinking when they did it   The worst part about this is there are no Blu-Rays that offer the original theatrical mix. They are all fold-downs of the same problematic remix. Since it seems there are no plans for a new remaster anytime soon, I would like to do one myself. So far I have collected the Austrian Blu-Ray as my video source as the transfer is less problematic than the current US releases, and I have the original non-anamorphic Anchor Bay DVD that came out around 1999 which I THINK includes the original mix as a Dolby Surround 2.0 ac3 track, but of course the audio is lossy and I cannot guarantee it isn't a remix of some sort, even if it is leaps and bounds better than the current mix. I also have the original VHS release I have been checking for reference, but it is an ex rental and not a very good source for my purposes.

     What I am wondering is does anyone here have the laserdisc that CBS/Fox put out back in the late 80s? From the research I have done I have concluded it is the only source of the original theatrical mix with uncompressed audio. Ideally, someone can do a bit perfect rip of this track and then it can be properly synced to the current master. I do not currently have the means of doing a bit perfect transfer as my laserdisc equipment only has analog RCA outputs, but I do have the means of syncing it up if someone is kind enough to provide it to me. This disc shows up from time to time on ebay, but it usually fetches a pretty penny which makes obtaining it cost prohibitive for me at the moment. Of course, the finished product would be shared with those who are interested.

Thank you!

Hi. I would like to start a several projects journey this year. Those projects have been thought over for years, mostly because of time needed to collects elements needed. But I want to know if anyone of those might be of any interest here on Fanres. Feel free to complete poll and add any question or commentary below. Here are some details on the projects I would like to tackle:


Project #1: The Odyssey/L'Odyssée/L'Odissea (1968) Franco Rossi

I've managed to collect both the german (with questionable recuts and edits) and Italian DVD (re-edited as a long movie) and download the French and Italian (RAI) TV versions from the TV distributors offering those online in VOD.

What I want to do: Use all the audio tracks and subtitles (including english) and re-edit all the sources to the original uncut TV format ("Relatively uncut" actually, since the original prologue is long gone since the 1970s from all the sources). Cleanining up the sources from any digiral artifacts (there are some, I think, but I could be wrong since it could be film grains). De-interlacing and 24ips pull down may be also in the cards (especially since it was all filmed on film stock). Stabilization and color correcting might also be in order and add bonus elements for a Fanres DVD release project (or Blu-ray, if upscaling techniques/workflows give good results). Recreating the original opening and end credits for the Italian and French version may also be considered as options.

More informations later.


Project #2; The three Little Pigs (1933) The uncensored, politically incorect version that the Mouse wants to bury (among other movies)

Ok. This one is and an overdone one. DVDs of the Jewish peddler exists (PAL image only), a japanese LD (that I'm still trying to track down) does have the full thing uncensored (audio & image) and also CDs (with a crappy audio quality) does exist. Some 16/35mm prints exists also with the audio intact (mostly european ones if I'm not mistaken).

I've been able to obtain some of those elements, including an official 1080p copy of the movie from a torrent tracker. What I would like to do:
-Take either the LD (NTSC), Pal DVD image (prints with the uncensored image are scarce) with the jewish pedler bits and do a 24 ips pull down and de-interlace those (also I'll have to remove all the unnecessary reapeating images created by the PAL/NTSC conversion). Then, Upscale it with Topaz AI (by making sure it doesn't mess anything on the image texture/grain), so I can seemlessly integrate the treated image to the 1080p image seemlessly. Another option would be upscaling the whole PAL image instead so it keeps it's integrity (if the 1st option fails)
-Clean up the audio (from the 16mm print) that include the Jew lines ("I'm giving free samples") and use it for either the jewish part or maybe the whole movie (depending on how well I can seemlessly blend it in with the restaured 1080p version). Another option, if the integration fails and difference is too jaring, I can also play with audio filters on both elements until I can find a middle ground so I can integrate them together seemlessly without compromizing the audio quality.

Of course, if better elements comes up, this'll be revisited.


Project #3 King Kong

This'll be quick and simple enough. Re-edit the movie (from the Blu-Ray) so it get closer to the censored version and then integrate the original 1st release french dub (only surviving in the censored film version). I've heard that maybe the original 1st release dubs of the italian and german may also have survived, but I haven't found them at all (yet) or any confirmation for that matter. I've only found the Italian re-release trailer on Youtube, for now. If there's anything else that can be added feel free to tell, I'm all ears and interested. I may consider adding a colored version as a potential bonus (Ewwwww !!!) for a DVD once the project is done.



There might be another project , but I still need to confirm with another user as I don't have amme the source elements and part of the work is already done by him anyway. So let's consider this as a mystery project to be confirmed.


There you have it all (in a shortened version). If there's any interests in one of those, which one would you chose (and why) ? Please complete the poll and if you want to elaborate or want to know more about any of these, feel free to ask below. Contributors and helps are also welcome.

Hello all. Does anyone here know how to create a new poll for a new thread in this forum ? I tried to look earlyer, but aside on "attach a new poll" I couln't find anything on how to create one here.

Can anyone help please ?

Thanks

Here's a weird one: a scene from the very end of this relatively early Argento film (which I just watched fairly recently and loved) has an extreme slow-mo shot that required a specialised, extremely high speed 35 mm camera to shoot, which could expose up to 3000 frames per second (as opposed to about 250 fps on a normal 35 mm camera).



There's an interview with Luigi Cozzi on the Shameless Screen Entertainment Blu-ray Disc release (GB) talking about it. He explains that this one shot was an absolute nightmare to get into the film.

For a start, they had a huge catastrophe when the first shot (which was expensive due to what happens in it, but I won't explain why for now) didn't get filmed at all due to the camera jamming. They realised that this was because they'd been testing it using black and white film, but hadn't actually loaded it with the stock they were shooting the film on, so when they filled it with the colour stock the additional thickness of the acetate was too much for it to move freely through the mechanism and it just completely jammed and none of the film got exposed whatsoever. Eventually they figured this out, loaded less film into the camera, and got the shot.



However, even when they eventually got the shot on film, there was a different problem: the film stock they used in this incredibly high speed camera wasn't loaded onto sprockets, which would just end up torn to shreds if you tried to use them to haul film through the camera at 3000 fps; it instead was yanked through very quickly by a shoe. But this happened *so* fast that the frames did not always line up perfectly: they found when reviewing the footage (only a few seconds worth, but they didn't have the opportunity to reshoot because of the expense of the scene already having blown the budget they had) that the frame lines had shifted down into the image instead of bordering the edges. So about 1/4 of the way down into the picture, there was a huge black line.

At this point I'm going to show you this, but it's going behind a spoiler tag in case you haven't seen the film and don't want to know what happens in the scene:

I've been lurking on these boards for a few days since I first stumbled on them, and decided to make an account today and introduce myself. First time joining any kind of message board, so forgive any missteps, please. I'm a film and video pro on the west coast with my own studio, spending a lot of time indoors right now as a result of covid, and ripping more laserdiscs than ever before. I've been hunting down rare and alternate versions of films for years and I love anything open matte. I hope to get to know some of you and share more soon.

Hey, guys.

Does anybody have the Region 1 DVD of Glory. It should include the isolated soundtrack in Dolby 5.1. My brother had the Region 2 DVD back in the day and it did include it, so I guess the Region 1 should have it, too. I want it especially for that piece of music : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIV0bp4DFQs that was also used in the Crying Freeman trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FflXm9_N6gY
Thanks.