Addition: I checked out Murphy's dead on the new disc, and the difference is barely noticeable. I would say it's down to how the scene was shot and it's baked into the negative, and not a product of Arrow taking Murphy's death from the old Blu-ray.

Will try and give it a proper watch over the weekend. Flicked through the theatrical cut last night and I thought it looked fine after turning the brightness down (quite a bit).

Didn’t watch the Murphy death scene so will be interesting to see what that looks like.

(2019-11-28, 09:11 AM)Stamper Wrote: Addition: I checked out Murphy's dead on the new disc, and the difference is barely noticeable. I would say it's down to how the scene was shot and it's baked into the negative, and not a product of Arrow taking Murphy's death from the old Blu-ray.

I watched the Arrow Theatrical (I actually prefer this cut) and have to say I noticed the slight difference in quality.
I put it down to them using an early master to recreate the Theatrical Cut until i read this thread.

Could the leaflet inset just be talking about the history of the 4k master they received?
I don't think they have done a fresh scan themselves and are working from previous video materials.

It looks exactly like they have used a 4k master of the Directors cut from MGM as the basis, and inserted shots from an old video master of the theatrical cut.
I doubt this is baked into the negative bud.

Watch the old Sony disc. It also has variations.

(2019-11-28, 02:35 PM)Stamper Wrote: Watch the old Sony disc. It also has variations.

I had a quick look at the Sony disc again (it's was my go to version), and watched the Murphy Death scene.

It didn't look like it varied and was consistent from shot to shot, from a technical point of view that is.
The 'does it hurt' take looks like a different set up / take than the following shot of the gang edit wise. Which maybe considering the conditions they we're filming in, probably caused a slightly different look to that setup (hope that makes sense).

It certainly looks like the same video master used patch up the theatrical cut on the arrow disc.
The colour correction helped further the master differences.
Id have to do a more detailed comparison to be 100% sure.

What is the history of the Criterion master?
Its the first time the Directors Cut appeared and I assume was put together by them with Verhoven involved.

That's right. I think it was video made so no HD exists, that's why they had to redo the editing later.

If the Arrow used the Sony disc to patch it up, it's really weird, they should have a scan of the Oneg with the scenes complete.

(2019-11-28, 10:54 PM)Stamper Wrote: That's right. I think it was video made so no HD exists, that's why they had to redo the editing later.

If the Arrow used the Sony disc to patch it up, it's really weird, they should have a scan of the Oneg with the scenes complete.

I agree, they scanned the Theatrical like you said, as that is how the original negative was conformed.
Then im gathering a workprint or Dailes for the Directors Cut inserts.

There should be a complete scan in 4K of the Theatrical Cut somewhere.

I would not be surprised though if the few theatrical shots discarded were not worked on in the clean up / remastering and the new restored 4k master is just the Directors Cut period.

Have you had a look at the Beta transfer of the TV version on the disc?
Its 4:3 Open Matte.
I was thinking of doing a changing AR version for my self with all the News Seqments in 4:3 using this as a source.
I once did the same using the Criterion and UK BD. It looked good

Between the 2.0/5.1 and 4.0 mixes on the DC, which is more accurate to previous versions? I don't have my copy yet to make direct comparisons. And do the theatrical mixes have differences as well?

The Criterion had to reconstruct the audio as there was none for sections of the unrated footage, if I remember correctly it was a big deal getting it right due to the LD being THX certified. When the director's cut was released on DVD by MGM the mix was different again.

The rumour was that the 5.1 mix was based off of a 70mm 6-track mix but there are absolutely no accounts of Robocop being screened in 70mm. It was however one of the first Dolby SR releases.

I have this new Arrow release, I've yet to check it out. I was in the middle of degraining/regraining the Sony Blu to reconstruct the theatrical cut when the Arrow was announced so my project went on ice. As much as I like the new remaster it feels like a flat flat o-neg scan, I can't help but think that the colour can be improved

So what would you guys fancy? I think at this point, a good thing would be to export to Sony disc image to Prores.
Then sync it to the Arrow. That way we can remux subtitles etc.

I think the 5.1 is a doctored piece of crap that sounds nothing like the original mixes. It edges off the film impact.

It's 4.0 and 2.0 all the way.

I also have the french LD rip which can be easily resynced to the Arrow.